| Author |
 Topic  |
|
| |
Current Topic Rating:  | Join the Forum to Rate this Topic at: Classic Motorcycling Australia Forums
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
 Posted - 26 Mar 2003 : 5:53:04 PM
|
|
If the HMRAV involve Harleys as asupport race at the Southern Classic at Broadford, what issues would you like to see covered? If you dont want them there thats Ok but I can say I am sure they will be so its now a matter of getting a good deal for everybody. Dont worry there will be 6 rides per class over the w/e
|
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2003 : 06:43:20 AM
|
If the Harleys run in the BEARS class at Broadford, I for one will be very happy. I love to ride in races where there is a full grid, and the Harleys are really in keeping with the spirit of historic racing. They make the right noises and the type of bike can only be described as 'historic'. They are the sort of bike my Seeley Commando can compete with on a fairly equal basis.
FULL GRIDS ARE WHAT WE NEED! It means more rides for everyone. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
 |
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2003 : 10:11:25 AM
|
Alan you have misunderstood things, the BEARS will not be at the Southern Clasic in October they will be at the Vic. State Historic Champs in November 2003.
The Harley talk is about a separate stand alone support event. As you all are aware I have had my backside burned over implied support that has not materialised, so I am looking for actuall support for the Harleys, names, engines numbers maybe. The Committee and race secretary is keen to involve them but we do not want egg on our face again. SO can you let us know if you arew likely to front thanks |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
matcho mick
Advanced Member
New South Wales
570 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2003 : 11:52:25 PM
|
G'day John,re southern classic at Broadford?,have i missed something,(must have been out of the room?)what happened to tradition etc?,why no more Winton,extra milage for us more northerly aspirants? hmmmm,Mick. |
|
|
|
Chris L
Level 1 Member
Victoria
12 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2003 : 11:57:33 PM
|
| John I have to agree with Alan, If we must run H.D. races at HMRAV meetings then put them in with the BEARs if and when we allow BEARs @ our meetings. As an interesting point, casting my mind back to when HMRAV ran the ORIGINAL Island Classic (and hugely successfull it was too, until stolen)HMRAV ran a few H.D.sporster races that attracted H.D. riders and their followers. However due to the followers obvious superiority (contempt) they rode straight thru the gate and forgot to pay the gatekeepers (HMRAV). Now I know these days HD riders are a different breed, but worth remembering anyway. |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2003 : 10:10:18 AM
|
| Macho, yes you must have beem out of the room, there is an earlier topic which explains the move. As Secretary I have to carry the flag, but I can say between you and I only that I do not support the move. But as Secretary I must work to achieve the best we can. As for running with the BEARS AUSTRALIA, that is happenning at the VIc. State Historic Champs in NOvember 2003.I think details have been included in our newsletter but an earlier topic also covers the issue, including the address of their web site.But I see your point and perhaps we could have a local BEARS based event but are there any machines out there to run. I am not fully up with the details, the approach has come thru the race secretary, but in a day or so I will have more detail. The Harley people approached us and ther thought of some sort of Harley challeng was floated. This web site is being used to try and improve the event by getting feedback thanks.The issue of not paying can be noted, and perhaps we just need to have a coupla truck drivers at the gate. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2003 : 7:35:32 PM
|
So when I asked the question in the earlier topic (You must be logged in to see this link.) John, you said: quote:
Originally posted by john
David I think you have misunderstood the issue. These riders are not asking for the Southern Classic to be moved to Broadford, they have asked if we can consider keeping it at Winton.
This has not been the case and the race did get changed. I would like to know the full story as to why the riders did not get a chance to vote.
Can you produce the voting stats to move the race from Winton to Broadford?, or was it that some of the "guys" did not want to travel to Winton??????????????????????????????? Well that is what it looks like to me.. The average joe just gets screwed over again.
The racing of Classics/Historics motorcycles get cut again. I can see why the sport is declining at a rapid rate. The users/riders are not been given the chance to have a say in how their sport progresses, it is shoved down their throat.
Don't get me wrong again John, you are doing a great job from what I can see, it is the others that do not want to come and talk to their members, because they know what is best, even if the riders don't like it. Makes me wonder why I keep this site running sometimes.
|
Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2003 : 09:28:09 AM
|
| Dave I cannot reveal publically the exact reason for the move but it was called for by individuals at a general meeting of the HMRAV the promoting club, to overcome some isues, involving the MotoGP date moving around, difficulty in getting dates fixed. You are right with you comments about lack of influence from riders, but I can say we have both noticed the very small group that does get involved. I do not know how to involve more people, I have heard the cry nobody listens but I know from other activities I am involved with that this may be a "cop out" just to not get involved, if organisations are set up to accept and promote comment they will get it. I have noticed many are ready to bag MV and MA, but we all know that abuse gets you nowhere but is quick to be given out. Recently at a public meeting I was told one of the staff members was a "lesbian bitch" I checked and now know it is false but why say it in the first place.I can say that since the committee was pushed into moving in this direction, we have taken steps to ensure procedures are improved, the Southern Classic will be a good as we can get it at Broadford we have chosen the long weekend interstate to attract other riders but now I have heard it is the same week end as Bathurst which may cause a big problem with spectators, but TV's and cmments from the spruker may etc may help that point |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2003 : 7:16:01 PM
|
John, I've mentioned to others that it could be a good idea to schedule motorcycle events in north eastern Victoria in the week following the GP. There are a lot of riders from up north who arrive continuously in Benalla for at least a week following the races at Phillip Island.
I'm interested to know how you were able to ascertain whether someone was a 'lesbian bitch' ot not. I would like to point out that there are laws about slander and discrimination. Whoever made the comment needs to move into the 21st century, it's pretty Unaustralian. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
79 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2003 : 8:44:17 PM
|
John. If you can't reveal publicly why the decision was made to move the Southern Classic to Broadford, could you Email me privately so we can make sure we comply with the official secrets act. I'm also interested to know why the Harley Sportsters cant be given races when the modern BEARS had the red carpet laid out to come to a historic event.
Like Alan I'm also interested to know what tactics you used to ascertain whether someone was a 'lesbian bitch' or not.
|
Al Kidd |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2003 : 9:50:07 PM
|
Geez do you blokes think I have nothing better to do than make up porkies!
1. L/B I spoke with the General manager about the claim and was advised it was untrue, also in my dealings I have never formed the opinion they may have been a Bitch for a start.
2. The BEARS came to us with an offer and evidence of numbers and commitment, supp.regs etc. They are happy to have Harleys race against them at the VIC Stae Historic champs.
3. The Harley boys mentioned it in passing to a member who mentioned it to the committee. The Harley boys have a problem of unreliabilty or commitment, both groups are working on it. To date nothing has been confirmed or finalised, whereas the BEARS had verifiable actions in place at the time.
4. The BEARS cannot attend the Southern Calssic because of their own commitments
5. In our litigious there are some matters which cannot be publically revealed for the hangover of the law and threats of its use are present.
If you cannot accept my word then TAKE MY JOB AND I WILL TAKE OFF WITH MY SIDECARS. If 99% of the detractors actually turned up, took resposibilty for their actions and statements and participated in club management things would be a lot better and clearer to all. Members would either influence things directly after discussions or understand why things happen. At the last General meeting I carried the bags for what I thought was a well supported 500cc solo plan. Not a single solo riding member turned up to support the concept and I had my backside burned. So please dont now ask" Why was not I consulted" just turn up for a start.
|
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2003 : 10:32:11 PM
|
As you may see I reacting to some comments which I feel are out of order, when my reporting of the L/B statement doubted, why would I make that up and present it for public discussion. I have enough things to do than fabricate lies. Get real! Also, Dave mentions "The users/riders are not been given the chance to have a say in how their sport progresses, it is shoved down their throat." I do not accept this as fact.
In the participation topic I pass on my observations that riders are not denied the chance to participate, they choose not to take up the right they are given by virtue of being a club member. I put a case that it is easier to be an armchair critic than to roll the sleeves up and try yourself. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
![]()
12 Posts |
Posted - 31 Mar 2003 : 1:16:31 PM
|
| Just on a lighter note,John maybe with some promotion and the support of the Hells Angels and Dykes on Bikes you could have a real winner of a race meeting with a "special" sort of after race party!! |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 31 Mar 2003 : 1:35:39 PM
|
| Sounds like a good idea, we had thought of Puppertry of the BREASTS as well. But seriously some sort of connection with the ladies may work, particularly if we had an all female race? |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
steve
Level 2 Member
Queensland
86 Posts |
Posted - 31 Mar 2003 : 10:50:26 PM
|
Hi All
I can understand John D He seems to trying everything to get people back racing, trying different classes & giving everyone more track time, the Knockers will never give a hand & complain about everything they can, If I was down your way John you will have my support.
Modern Bears provide great racing draws Sponsors & crowds! pay there way in other words, if it helps to cover costs in running a meeting we will get more race meetings!! I think Bears bikes are a lot better than the "supercarts" I get more rides per licence costs with bears, if people think the worlds racing scene finished after 1962 500ccs Classic Motorcycles have there heads in the sand! time waits for no-one, no one likes change even if it for the better!! John keep your head no one said it was easy. John I'm the Editor of the Club Historic R/R newsletter here in Qld, it's been running for a couple of years now! certain people made it that hard to produce the news letter it was honestly a joke!! & yes the knockers are still carrying on, they will complain to everyone but yourself, what a bad job he,s making of it, but will never give a hand in any shape what so ever,I still have a few members helping me with info for the news letter which is great but the other 98% don't.Also My blood is still boiling after at a recent meeting where prize money was paid to up to 350cc & up to 500cc CLASSIC"s "ONLY" & all the other classes got a cheap medallion for overall, everyone else paid for the 350s & 500s prize money, myself & a fair few others are not returning, all I got was a program even spelt my name wrong.
Steve |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2003 : 10:37:08 PM
|
| The Harleys are out by virtue of the fact they cannot get enough Harleys alone to partake in a serires of races, nowadays they race as Millwukee Iron and include Buells. HMRAV decided Buells were not appropriate at the Southern Classic. So we are out there looking for ideas. Please help? How can we attract more riders and spectators to Broadford. I would go for 100 sidecars if we could find 'em. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
79 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 2:33:00 PM
|
| Some double standards from HMRAV maybe? Buells & Harleys are not appropriate at the Southern Classic but modern Ducati Superbikes are okay at the Vic Historic Titles. An explaination would be facinating. |
Al Kidd |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 2:52:30 PM
|
Explanation!
Hartwell MCC who did run the Vis Historic champs strongly advised having a support class to help finace the meeting. They had buckets normally. The HMRAV committee choked at the thought of buckets. By chance the BEARS emailed us asking could they fit them into a program. As a sidecar rider I have learned not to look a gift horse in the mouth and the Committee decided to look at it. They offered us a group of machines which included pre 1980 machines, as well as the others. We were hoping nobody would notice the Aprillias etc!!!
So it was a choice between buckets, BEARS or no event. I was pushing for a sidecar only meeting but support was thin. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 4:14:38 PM
|
As I understand it there are about four classes of BEARS. The one I'm interested in is 'heritage BEARS' which I believe goes up to about '72. If there are a couple of races over a weekend for 'modern' Ducatis as well as Buells, I wouldn't be too fussed, they're both old fashioned cr*p. If they pay for the meeting we should welcome them.
If they run in the same race as 'heritage BEARS' - so what?, as long as there are separate trophies. It's time for a bit of a change - innovation? |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 4:24:37 PM
|
| Alan, I know the water is bad in Benalla but I did not think it affectted your sight. The BEARS topic lists 5 classes within the BEARS formula and the Heritage finishes at 1980. the BEARS web site has all the break downs which are very detailed but based on power to weight ratio. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
steve
Level 2 Member
Queensland
86 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 10:09:25 PM
|
Hi All
When the Bears Fellows came up to Qld there were 43 entries all paying X amount of dollars & the Bears Club provided all the Trophies
tallied all the points over Australia & for the Qld meeting we got 4 races per weekend!! all the local race club did was provide track time, most locals Historic racers complained that they are so much faster than the old bikes it dangerous!! yes they do go past pretty damm fast but I feel safer in bears than some of the period 4 cazy's win at any cost Post Classic Honda's there is not much speed differences between the 2, It helped out the local club & I don't think they minded the extra money & punters paying to get in to watch the BEARS & Allan "Heritage Bears" is up to 1980, on the week-end I had a din dong battle with the 2 Smokes Aprilia's top speeds were about the same but the brakes are something else But mixed it with them & a few older dead ducks it was all really good racing the crowd come up later & said that was the best racing all weekend & when is the nex't one!! As soon as some of the Classic blokes change the way they think there won't be any racing for the Historic's because of the cost involved running a meeting these day's I'm sick of some of the attitudes coming from the period 3 crowd as in anything after 1962 is a modern bike & don't give two hoots about anything else You still don't get the same rights if you ride period 4 compared to period 3!! Until certain people change there views towards Post Classic's & Forgotten Era let alone BEARS the Sport & crowds will die a slow death.
Steve |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2003 : 10:23:55 PM
|
| Steve why dont you run meetings thru a different club and dont invite the P2 and P3 there are so few compared to the total number. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2003 : 07:22:21 AM
|
Sorry about the 'heritage BEARS gaff' - not thinking straight, at the time. I believe the BEARS idea is great, and whatever the cutoff date, it gives the opportunity to have a slightly DIFFERENT competition.
I don't think excluding P2 or P3 from historic meetings would be constructive. I agree with some of the HMRAV stalwarts that P3 is the premier class in historic racing. That doesn't mean it should be promoted to the exclusion or detriment of other classes, or that riders of later bikes should set up meetings at which only 'more modern' bikes run.
There's plenty of room on the historic racing grids, have a look at any meeting, and have a count. I even seen races started where there are ten bikes only - the grid at Winton holds 40 and at Phillip Island I believe 45 is the limit. IF YOU WANT MORE RIDES,change the formats of events and FILL THE GRIDS.
|
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Topic Locked
